How does the LDS church deal with an inter-sexed person who is neither clearly male or female?

I was raised as a male, but I feel like I should have been born female. If I change my looks with surgery to look unmistakably like a female, the church will excommunicate me.How does the LDS church deal with an inter-sexed person who is neither clearly male or female?I've never heard about "an inter-sexed person who is neither clearly male or female" - everyone is either male or female!



Some people have sex-change operations but I have no idea what the church does with a person like that. Never heard of a caseHow does the LDS church deal with an inter-sexed person who is neither clearly male or female?
True intersexed and hermaphrodites are very rare. Typically, someone may appear to be intesexed, but modern medicine can determine which sex they actually are. From your description, you are the true, rare type that modern medicince can't completely determine which sex the person should be (thus the parents and doctor have to decide when the person is an infant what sex to raise them as). - This part of the answer is for the many that have answered and don't seem to understand what you mean by intersexed, and are assuming transexual/transgender.



As it is such a rare condition, the LDS church does not speak to it in General Conference or such.



Bishop's are expected to approach such situations with a lot of prayer, and to seek help from their priesthood leaders (such as a stake president, area authority or first presidency).



In such a delicate situation in which there are no medical answers (as you say you are not clearly either sex), you would most likely not be excommunicated over this. There is a high probability such a situation could be directed to the prophet for direction, or it could be dealt with by the local bishop and patriarch.



Not every situation has a cut and paste answer. You have to rely on the Lord to guide you and your leaders in this situation. You have to have the faith to accept the guidance of the Lord and your leaders, also. The Family Proclamation clearly states that we were male and female before we came to this earth and recieved our mortal bodies. You need the Lord, because he knows what your spirit is, and your body and lifestyle needs to match your spirit.How does the LDS church deal with an inter-sexed person who is neither clearly male or female?Although I personally liked Jenster's answer the best, you should really go through the proper priesthood authorities since this question is not easily answered neither is there a black and white answer. I'm assuming you are a member of the Church but are you assuming the Church will excommunicate you or have you asked someone with authority to answer you? I'd love to give you a more complete answer but I just can't.




I have not had the occasion to participate in a gender problem, but I have participated in church courts. They are acts of love to heal the soul of somone who has guilt or offenses and burdens that weigh them down. it is not acusatorial, demeaning or confrontational. It is designed to help the person to get back on the road to spiritual health.



I reccomend this, talk to your Bishop about your issue before you do it, if you are still adamant about it you have your agency to do as you choose and you should not worry about the consequenses of your membership, that is the price you pay.



The matters serious enough to warrant consideration by a bishop’s court have varied. In the early pioneer era, they included not only crimes and sexual misconduct, but also breaches of loyalty to an embattled community. For example, during one period, patronizing gentile merchants could result in Church discipline.

Confession in Lds Doctrine and Practice, BYU Studies, vol. 36 (1996-97), Number 2--1996-97

Certain standards for discipline, and by implication for confession, came to be regularized by inclusion in printed instructions given to bishops. In 1928 the instructions stated that the following transgressions would ordinarily justify holding a bishop’s court: infractions of the moral law (such as fornication and adultery); liquor drinking and bootlegging; criminal acts such as thievery, burglary, or murder; and apostasy or opposition to the Church.

Confession in Lds Doctrine and Practice, BYU Studies, vol. 36 (1996-97), Number 2--1996-97

In 1934 the instructions added drunkenness, cruelty to wives or children, and promoting polygamy. Subsequent changes were mostly in terminology, although in 1968 homosexual acts were added to the list of sexual sins.

Confession in Lds Doctrine and Practice, BYU Studies, vol. 36 (1996-97), Number 2--1996-97

In 1976 grounds for discipline were put under two general categories: (1)deliberate disobedience to Church regulations and (2)moral transgressions, with all the previous offenses listed and incest, child molesting, embezzling Church funds, and "unchristianlike conduct" added. In an undated supplement to the 1976 instructions, the list no longer included intemperance but now specified abortion (subject to exceptions). In 1985 transsexual operations were added to the list.

Confession in Lds Doctrine and Practice, BYU Studies, vol. 36 (1996-97), Number 2--1996-97

The 1989 instructions adopted a different format and gave as grounds for discipline a long list of illustrative felonies plus a number of items that would be misdemeanors or noncriminal acts (adultery, fornication, homosexual relations, sex-change operation, spouse abuse, abandonment of family responsibilities, drug misuse, abortion, and apostasy). The only deletion of a major item found in previous instructions was the offense of unchristianlike conduct.

Confession in Lds Doctrine and Practice, BYU Studies, vol. 36 (1996-97), Number 2--1996-97

Over the years, although two items have been dropped-intemperance in 1976 (now seen more as illness or weakness than as serious evil, despite strong Church commitment to the Word of Wisdom) and unchristianlike conduct in 1989 (probably seen as too vague to be applied evenly)-the tendency has been to include more items. The listed sins only illustrate the grounds on which confession is expected of all compliant members. Unspecified offenses of comparable gravity are not excluded from this obligation.How does the LDS church deal with an inter-sexed person who is neither clearly male or female?If a person has a legitimate medical condition, they can make their case to the Bishop and up to the First Presidency. The Church is not going to encourage gender change for purely emotional reasons. The Church teaches that gender is a integral part of our pre-mortal existence and will be through eternity. If a person can show they will be female through eternity, I am sure the leadership will listen.How does the LDS church deal with an inter-sexed person who is neither clearly male or female?
I would pray for guidance and understanding. Surgery is such a drastic desicion that I don't think anyone can make on their own. Have you spoken to anyone at your church about this? I'm Christian, don't know much about mormonism/LDS.



Again, I'd like to apologise if it sounded like an offensive remark, after doing some research (via wikipedia!!) I can honestly say that it must be very difficult for you. I'm not sure what you believe but I believe that God, in His mercy, never puts on anyone more than they can handle (I'm quite a testament to that!) and through prayer, you may recieve some important guidance. I've never heard of someone who's DNA cannot be determined to be either male or female. You're different, rejoice in it!



EDIT: If you've never gentically or physically been male or female, just raised that way, I personally can't see a problem with changing. I'm sorry, I hadn't read it right!
Wow, not to many people helpful here, huh? Many of them have no idea what you are talking about.



I can't be much help either as I am not LDS.



But here is my opinion. Not everyone is born perfect. Some people have obvious problems from day one and many of these are corrected with surgery. Things that are not life threatening are usually delayed. I consider this a delay. If you wish to have a gender than I don't think the LDS or anyone else for that matter has a right to tell you otherwise. It's easy for people to judge when they don't face the same issue. If the LDS kicks you out, there are still plenty of other spiritual paths that are open to you, or you could continue to follow your own spiritual path on your own. People are not perfect. The LDS may think they know what should be done under these circumstances, but that doesn't make it so.



Good luck to you.How does the LDS church deal with an inter-sexed person who is neither clearly male or female?
I'm not sure how they would "deal" with you... most religions have problems with things like that, but I don't know much about LDS.



Anyway, there are support groups for people like yourself. You are not alone, and you shouldn't have to go through this alone. Regardless of the reaction of your church, you need to follow your heart. Good luck.



http://www.isna.org/



http://www.xyxo.org/isgi/index.html
There is help for those who want to counteract such feelings, and do not espouse them. For whatever reason your mind thinks that, that does not affirm that God made some mistake or that you should give into such an inclination.



God created us as male or female for a purpose, it is a part of our eternal identity, and not to be controverted merely by some temporal mental inclination, or, in my opinion, chemical imbalance.



Again there is nothing wrong with having such a nagging feeling trouble you, it's giving into it and embracing it that is against God's clearly defined law.



Finally, since we are in a fallen world God does allow for a few (very very very rare exceptions) true hermaphrodites or female/male chimera to come out in genetic mishap. Then their sex may or may not be determined conclusively by DNA analysis. When the issue remains unresolved then it becomes a matter of prayer, pondering, personal revelation, and finally it would probably require an inspired pronouncement in a patriarchal blessing.



Make no mistake that the spirit that inhabits a body is either male or female, and 100% of the time the physical body reflects and attests to your eternal gender when the gender is physically discernable.
I want to be a pastor so maybe I can clear this up. Although you where born male...you feel as thought you should be a female. Ok I got that. My response would be....if you where coming to my church that that is your desion and that you would have to take it up with God. It's not my desion to excommiuate(my church we don't do that at all) and I would hope you would keep coming to the church. I believe that we can not judge others because we oursleves fall short of God and that he should be the one to judge you. Now I couldn't help what other people would say or do but I would hope that they would conitinue there friendship with you. I know I would. And Jesus would too.
Regardless of how you were raised, it would help if we knew more about how androgenous you actually are. I know- probably way too personal for this forum... email me?



What do your genetics say- XY or XX?

What kind of genitalia do you have?

What about hormonal issues (look up AIS- interesting stuff)?



I'm guessing from your statement about being excommunicated that you've talked to your bishop about this.



Re-read the Proclamation to the World on the Family, paying special attention to the stuff about gender.



Pray with humility and sincerity.



Counsel with your bishop.



Read your scriptures
Seems like you're pretty familiar already with the churches stance.

I'm sorry, and it sucks, and hopefully your friends and family will see beyond the stupid church canon and realize that it's more important that you're happy than that you bow to the edicts of church elders.
Intersexuality is the term adopted by medicine during the 20th century applied to human beings who cannot be classified as either male or female (through biology). (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intersex for longer definition)

IF you are inter-sexed then I would think its a bit more complicated then just feeling same-sex attraction, or the desire to be the opposite sex. IF you do have both male and female parts, the only way to know what to do would be to speak with your local bishop or stake president (as it is quite rare). On the other hand, if you are clearly male then continue reading....



I do not doubt that you feel the way you do, and I feel for your burden (as it is a heavy one). We are each given trials to deal with, and this is one of them.



Dalin H. Oaks answers this question. Here is an exurb followed by the weblink for the rest of this in depth interview



"The distinction between feelings or inclinations on the one hand, and behavior on the other hand, is very clear. It’s no sin to have inclinations that if yielded to would produce behavior that would be a transgression. The sin is in yielding to temptation. Temptation is not unique. Even the Savior was tempted.



The New Testament affirms that God has given us commandments that are difficult to keep. It is in 1 Corinthians chapter 10, verse 13: “There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.”



I think it’s important for you to understand that homosexuality, which you’ve spoken of, is not a noun that describes a condition. It’s an adjective that describes feelings or behavior. I encourage you, as you struggle with these challenges, not to think of yourself as a ‘something’ or ‘another,’ except that you’re a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and you’re my son, and that you’re struggling with challenges."



http://newsroom.lds.org/ldsnewsroom/eng/…



may God give you strength in your trials
As if your life wasn't difficult enough I am imagining. Why does the church shun the people who need it the most, that's what I want to know. Not that I find trans people's weak in any way, as a gay man, an atheist at that, I was shunned by my church. All loving my @ss.
they treat you just like any member is treated. Keep the commandments and you won't get excommunicated.
Take a look here, for other Mormons who are like you. They may be better suited to answer your question.
God created you just as you are. Are you telling God that He is wrong?
There's one problem with your example: You are clearly male.
www.theophostic.com and you wil be happy with who God create dyou to be.
Are your genes XX or XY?
Have the operation, and if you intend to stay in the church?, then move!

The church 's stance on this issue is wrong. Why should they care what sex you are, anyway?



But it seems to me that they have failed you in this issue already.

Sometimes religion has too much to say about sexual things in your life!!

Particularly a gender thing like this!!
You could follow the example of Senator Ernie Chambers (Nebraska) and file a law suit against God. It should trickle down the food chain from there to ensure you equal rights as a transgendered Mormon